• We have upgaded to the latest version of XenForum and the process finished without any errors!!!! Enjoy the new forum!

Gorgar's heart beats no more.

Gorgar

New Member
Feb 12, 2016
9
0
1
59
Lake Simcoe
Hello to all.

Let me tell you about my buddy Gorgar. He has been with me for 20 years and played perfect for the first 12 years until he started getting sick. I shut him down and pulled his batteries 7 or 8 years back figuring when there was a point in my broke arse pay to pay life that I may have a glimmer of hope to once again hear his heartbeat. I'm still stuck in my pay to pay existence but got tired of seeing him dark and silent.

I know he needs a new master display (ball and match are blank which keeps me from setting it up but I was happy where it was).and I was told it wouldn't affect him internally. I was told over ten years back I could bring in my old master display as an exchange and take a good one home for 60 bucks.

About 8 years back we were playing him and the free game knocker solenoid froze and started smoking so I shut him down immediately. A couple of months went by and I figured I would fire him up. The knocker solenoid wasn't doing anything strange so I played a round. NOTHING seemed right, the sounds were not matching the actions, his heartbeat would race and carry on to the next player instead of resetting to a slow beat again. This was when I put him to sleep.

I assumed when I woke him up again all these years later that he would at least be in the same state, playable but off kilter. Nope, all he does is sit, lights on (not flashing) with 1496 1 (and the 1 will flicker back and forth and end up on 1496 3). I have checked for corrosion on or around the terminals, none, that whole board looks perfect, batteries are fresh and installed correctly. I followed some tips given to me when I introduced myself and no matter what I do I can't even get him into attract mode let alone play mode. After doing the open door off on hoe down a few times the closest I got to attract mode was him acting like he was scoring a last ball or something. Solenoids would reset, he would spit the ball out and very very very faintly (volume is turned up) I can hear him counting down bonus points with the lights matching and player one in the 800 thousands. Then all of a sudden, right back to lights only with all 4 four players slowly accumulating points.
Most of the time it's 1496 1(3) though.

While I was messing around I noticed the driver board has 100% issues, perhaps this is messing around with his brain and may explain symptoms above that may not end up being battery or memory protect issues?

My guess this has something to do with my knocker solenoid and may very well cause issues that I described above, but who am I to judge? I am mechanically inclined, fix my cars, lawnmowers or whatnot, a household handyman but when it comes to electronic repair I am so very lost and would NEVER even attempt to solder a computer board nor would I even know where to begin testing and with what to test with and what it all means. LoL

I have no problems removing the boards, replacing this, replacing that but I don't do circuit boards. Here are a couple pics showing the more than obvious. I'm sure you guys will know what that particular rom thingy does and what it may interfere with, any help would be greatly appreciated keeping in mind my eyes may glaze over and roll to the back of my head if you start to tech me out too much. ;c)

If there is anyone local (Lake Simcoe, Barrie, gta, Bradford) that may have a spare functioning driver board and could make me some sort of exchange plus cash sort of deal it would sure save me some heartache knowing that this board at least won't be an issue. This would allow me to fire him up, cross my fingers and go from there.

driver board.jpg IMG_20160213_120831.jpg
 

Gorgar

New Member
Feb 12, 2016
9
0
1
59
Lake Simcoe
The driver board is a big bag of ugly, I have to guess the MPU is her twin sister :eek:
Enjoy the reading ==> https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-bulletproofing-williams-system-6
Grab everything from ED @ GPE https://greatplainselectronics.com/products.asp?cat=45

If you are not inclined, there is a fantastic board guy in Montreal with good rates.

Hi there

No sir, all the other boards are next to mint. The driver board must of been when the postman dropped by and rang twice. The more I look at the driver board the more I just want to replace it. There are many questionable areas and far too much to fix cheaper than buying another one would be my guess.

Thanks for the links btw. For now I put him back to sleep until I replace that board, no use torturing the poor guy.

P1120541.JPG P1120542.JPG
 

Gorgar

New Member
Feb 12, 2016
9
0
1
59
Lake Simcoe
I'm guessing it was stored in an unheated garage ?

No sir, he has never spent a day of his life out in the cold since I've owned him (20yrs) and was stored in a warehouse from a failed pizza shop before me. I put a couple pics of the mpu and sound boards, the power board is good as well it's just that driver board that shows it's age. I'm just going to find one somewhere and replace it as there is far to much poo poo on that board to bother trying to fix. I then will wake him up again and go from there.

Cabinet is in amazing original condition he even still has some of the original shipping protector tape on some of the chrome. Back glass is about as perfect as it gets, play field is almost perfect less two small areas that have chipped away from game play. Under the hood is amazingly clean as well. Almost makes me think the driver board was hijacked at some point and swapped out with a P.O.S.
 

Gorgar

New Member
Feb 12, 2016
9
0
1
59
Lake Simcoe
mint? picture 2 in original post just does not look good right by the orange sticker
That whole driver board doesn't look right, sticks out like a sore thumb when you look at the rest of the boards. So many hot spots and corrosion, it's a cancerous growth that must be eradicated. It's the other boards I refer to as next to mint, certainly not this one. :c)
 

eh97ac

Active Member
Nov 19, 2012
636
149
43
Mississauga
Boards & components are now 35 years+, nothing is mint about those boards. Anyways, I'd start the with the battery holder on the MPU and corrosion on the driver board. Remove the parts, neutralize the boards and install new parts + remote battery holder + interconnect.

If you are going to buy new boards, buy the all in one from Rottendog.
 

Gorgar

New Member
Feb 12, 2016
9
0
1
59
Lake Simcoe
Boards & components are now 35 years+, nothing is mint about those boards. Anyways, I'd start the with the battery holder on the MPU and corrosion on the driver board. Remove the parts, neutralize the boards and install new parts + remote battery holder + interconnect.

If you are going to buy new boards, buy the all in one from Rottendog.

Nod, I agree, old boards. I guess I was more so referring to the visual aspects of the other boards compared to the driver board. I thought maybe the driver board was replaced at some point but upon closer inspection, all the original vendor stamps are on all the boards (as well as stamped all over the place... overkill LoL). I guess the driver board due to it producing more heat than the other boards would naturally age faster (so to speak).

I had considered going the all in one route but by the time I get hit with shipping charges and exchange rates we're pushing $500+. Plus don't I have to replace the power supply as well or is the new power supply more an energy saving option due to lower power consumption of the new board.

I have seen nice updated driver boards online for an average $200us shipped which is still pushing $280cdn. I'll look around for something local 1st to try and see what kind of numbers I'm looking at Vs online. My guess is it would be more expensive to have someone fix and upgrade the original board as I'm certainly not confident enough in my soldering skills to attempt to repair the board myself. If he needs to nap a little longer while I figure out what route to take, that's OK with me.

I'll look into battery and MPU issues once I have a good driver board. No use wasting time on the MPU when I know this driver board has issues plus if I decide to save up for the all in one (which seems the better option) I wouldn't need to to bother trouble shooting the MPU at all.
 

eh97ac

Active Member
Nov 19, 2012
636
149
43
Mississauga
Exchange your board with one of the local electronic guru's, probably the cheapest alternative. PM ("Start a conversation") Menace, he might have a working one ready to go.
 

Menace

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Nov 14, 2012
2,440
255
83
Santiago de Aurora
I don't have any sys6 stuff on hand but I can tackle all of the repairs on it. At the very least the 40 pin interconnect header and sockets will need to be replaced, and if that doesn't solve all of the weird behaviour likely a PIA has failed. The locked on coil will need the transistor replaced as well.

D
 

Gorgar

New Member
Feb 12, 2016
9
0
1
59
Lake Simcoe
I don't have any sys6 stuff on hand but I can tackle all of the repairs on it. At the very least the 40 pin interconnect header and sockets will need to be replaced, and if that doesn't solve all of the weird behaviour likely a PIA has failed. The locked on coil will need the transistor replaced as well.

D
I might just take you up on that. I looked at the driver board a little closer and it may not be as wiped out as I thought. The worst seems to be concentrated around that one small close up area, the rest seems reasonable or at least not corroded like that one area is.

Ya, I figured that game knocker transistor for sure as it's no use replacing the solenoid until the initial cause is fixed or I'll just blow the new one. The 40 pin interconnect and sockets are certainly a good call as well.

At least if I know the driver board is good I can carry on to address the MPU (if needed at all). I did steal an emery board off my wife (I'm sure I'll hear about THAT LoL) and went over the battery terminals. He did boot into the 1496 1 but when I did the open door on off dosey doe hoe down he seemed to go almost straight into all that wonky stuff he was doing this time.

It would actually go into attract mode for a couple seconds, the solenoids would reset, kick the ball out and count down a last player score or something. I put the ball into play and the flippers, bumpers and targets worked while it was counting down, then it would go dead, just lights again and both LEDs on the MPU went solid on. All of this with the sound so low I could barely make it out, volume adjust was half way so it wasn't low volume. I put him back to sleep, don't want to risk frying anything else.

ummmm, Dominican Republic? I'm not sure if I want to go through the shipping and handling route though, I was hoping I could take a drive instead. Unless you're off the 404 and just doing a little word play with your location a bit? ;)

I've got to get out and do some stuff but I would like to PM you later about this if you don't mind.
 

Menace

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Nov 14, 2012
2,440
255
83
Santiago de Aurora
Yeah, just a play on words I'm about 30mins south of you by the sounds of it. My shop is currently RAMMED with clients machines (I think 7 at the moment) so bringing the whole game to me would be the best option just not at this moment. You can bring me the MPU and the driver PCB and I can replace the headers and sockets, any blown transistors etc but I don't have a game in house to test the PCB's in. Totally your call how you'd like to handle this, PM me and we can discuss options.

Doug