FS The Uncanny X-Men LE & Limited Loyalty Program

[ManaLounge]

Hey folks!!

I now have The Uncanny X-Men Limited Editions in stock and on hand in London! I've got 2 left, low numbers #56 and #71.

If you're in the London area and want to see it in person, hit me up. Can pick up/ship out ASAP.

also...

Limited Loyalty Program
This is a program I'm going to start doing where LE buyers of the previous title will get first right of refusal (with a small deadline) on the newly announced cornerstone and will be queued in priority based on purchase date vs. allocation total. Meaning, if you bought a Wick LE from me, you'd have first crack on the X-Men. I'd let you know and give you a small window of time to confirm, otherwise moves to next in line, then any non-previous LE buyers based on inquiry time.

Happy flipping all!!

 

[Hammerbrother]

I get this business practice but I also hate it. It's the reason I couldn't get the limited editions I wanted from P1 iver the years. Unless you've been in the hobby for over a decade, buying LEs consistently, it's almost impossible to get desirable titles. Sure, I can go get a Venom lol

 

[ManaLounge]

I get this business practice but I also hate it. It's the reason I couldn't get the limited editions I wanted from P1 iver the years. Unless you've been in the hobby for over a decade, buying LEs consistently, it's almost impossible to get desirable titles. Sure, I can go get a Venom lol

Hey man, Venom is fun I actually quite enjoy it still!

I equate it to junk food. Really fast fun action but not feeling like a ton of strategy. Still enjoyable to eat now and then.

I've clocked about 15 games on Xmen now. This one feels incredible already. The shots are really fun and the art and music package are top tier.

My no bias opinion is this easily lands in top 10 in short time. It's earned a spot to move downstairs for me lol

 

[ritewhereiwant2b]

Limited Buyer Priority
This is a program I'm going to start doing where LE buyers of the previous title will get first right of refusal (with a small deadline) on the newly announced cornerstone and will be queued in priority based on purchase date vs. allocation total. Meaning, if you bought a Wick LE from me, you'd have first crack on the X-Men. I'd let you know and give you a small window of time to confirm, otherwise moves to next in line, then any non-previous LE buyers based on inquiry time.

Looks like P1 will continue to get my business now that Jerry is gone. I am not a serial LE buyer and this practice discriminated against buyers like me. I reached out to P1 enquiring about JAWS LE before the announcement (after Jerry left cause he prioritized customers and i stopped doing businesswith him) and I was delighted to hear: no problem, you are now on the list. As simple as that, first come, first serve. Martin made me feel like a valued customer.

I own 3 LE's, MM (2016), Rush (2022) and JAWS (2024) - it's incredible that the
Limited Buyer Priority could potentially shut me out from an LE I know I would want to buy not to mention making me feel like an under-valued customer.

 

[ManaLounge]

Looks like P1 will continue to get my business now that Jerry is gone. I am not a serial LE buyer and this practice discriminated against buyers like me. I reached out to P1 enquiring about JAWS LE before the announcement and I was delighted to hear: no problem, you are now on the list. As simple as that, first come, first serve. Martin made me feel like a valued customer.

I own 3 LE's, MM (2016), Rush (2022) and JAWS (2024) - it's incredible that the
Limited Buyer Priority could potentially shut me out from an LE I know I would want to buy not to mention making me feel like an under-valued customer.

Hmmm not a bad perspective at all tbh. I was coming from it with a loyalty angle (should have been named that) and not an exclusionary, but I can see some issues with it as well.


Will consider your feedback, thank you!

 

[pinballjah]

Funny how the market has changed now that LEs don't sell out any more and typically lose about $3-$4k US in value after a couple years. I know a lot of LE buyers who buy used now as they just don't hold their value. I just picked up an LE with topper for $5k US below retail made in Dec. 2022, so it saved me about $7,500 CDN if I bought new.

 

[Jeff K.]

@ Pinballjah, agree that the LE market has all but entirely changed since Covid. Stern making 1000 LEs at considerably higher prices means the high demand is now all but dissipated. The days of buying & flipping these at a profit are likely gone and the vast majority of the LEs going forward are going to be readily available at a big discount in the secondary market, particularly in the USA. Losing $3k+ on a LE is going to be painful.
Additionally , we now have multiple distributors & choices over & above P1.

I do wish all the new entrants like ManaLounge to be successful in providing some competition in this local space; too bad we didn’t have this choice during Covid when a number of LEs were unobtainium for many local buyers.

 

[Flipper Ripper]

Distributors need to stop with these "new" incentives for purchasing games. The fact is, machines are too expensive now for the curent market, they are no longer a "want" when we were all locked up at home during COVID and the small market is already saturated with machines so running out of space. Instead of lowering prices on machines, we are now seeing "creative" ways of buying them or things like free defective playfields as wall hangers. I don't know about you guys, but I don't really want to hang a piece of wood with a bunch of holes on my wall. I don't want Sterns garbage as an incentive to pay for their overpriced machines. What distributors need to do is take a stand for buyers and tell Stern to lower the prices of their machines. You're trying to sell the idea of an "exclusive" loyalty program for buying LEs when in the same breahte you're trying to get rid of 2 LEs right now because people are not lined up to get them anymore. FOMO is gone. People woke up and ran out of room and money and are sick of the same pig with different makeup on. Distributors need to communicate and demand more from Stern and don't get me started on Greedy JJP.

 

[ManaLounge]

Unfortunately I don't see a reality where machines are going to cost any less. We can be hopeful, but i would expect them to go up along with everything else going up because the rate our governments print money.

And yes the two are related, two left and offering an incentive thought it was a fun idea but guess not to some lol

That aside, you should try XMen. Feels a good bit different from other machines to me!

 

[GUARD]

The only way games will cost less is for them to be "equipped" like home games.

 

[MoPin]

I don’t see the list prices of NIB games coming down (if ever), however that does not mean we don’t see a sales promotion from time to time to spur on sales like has been done for TMNT and other slow selling games. I think ultimately games have reached a price point where you need to know you really want a game before laying out the cash, as you are certainly going to lose money on it, as you should as it’s a luxury item with a depreciating use factor. No matter if you can afford an LE, Prem or Pro, best to only buy a game that you love and plan to keep to make the loss worth while, unless you don’t mind losing money for your playing enjoyment.

 

[Flipper Ripper]

Unfortunately I don't see a reality where machines are going to cost any less. We can be hopeful, but i would expect them to go up along with everything else going up because the rate our governments print money.

You may be right, but in business it's supply and demand. If the demand is low and they are sitting on machines and distributors fight back and say we don't want to purchase "X" ammount because they aren't moving then something has to give. Things go on "sale" in every other industry. Prices of things like TVs always go down and size always goes up. I don't think Pinball is some special item that must always go up in price considering the profit margins for Stern and JJP on those things are HUGE. Think about JJP GnR it was 8,500 USD when it came out and now if you want to purcahse it from JJP it's 12k for the same machine. They were obviously making a profit at 8.5 k so what happened in 3 years that the machine now costs 3.5k more. These things aren't that expensive to build. This is all greedflation and nothing to do with government printed money.

 

[ManaLounge]

You may be right, but in business it's supply and demand. If the demand is low and they are sitting on machines and distributors fight back and say we don't want to purchase "X" ammount because they aren't moving then something has to give. Things go on "sale" in every other industry. Prices of things like TVs always go down and size always goes up. I don't think Pinball is some special item that must always go up in price considering the profit margins for Stern and JJP on those things are HUGE. Think about JJP GnR it was 8,500 USD when it came out and now if you want to purcahse it from JJP it's 12k for the same machine

Well to be fair, I think any price increases are probably due to base supply chain costs increasing (energy and labor) and less manufacturer 'greed'. I don't think its a matter of "Well, lets just make Y% profit instead of X% now". Especially given competition in the manufacturer space too.

In the event supply and demand getting out of sync, I would imagine just less machines would be produced instead of a reduction in base cost, because again, I don't think they're as large of profit margins as we might speculate.

And fwiw, I don't know any specifics or have any insight, so can't really speak to it, I'm just speculating based off general business theory. Its fun to talk shop lol

 

[Flipper Ripper]

Well to be fair, I think any price increases are probably due to base supply chain costs increasing (energy and labor) and less manufacturer 'greed'. I don't think its a matter of "Well, lets just make Y% profit instead of X% now". Especially given competition in the manufacturer space too.

In the event supply and demand getting out of sync, I would imagine just less machines would be produced instead of a reduction in base cost, because again, I don't think they're as large of profit margins as we might speculate.

And fwiw, I don't know any specifics or have any insight, so can't really speak to it, I'm just speculating based off general business theory. Its fun to talk shop lol

They produce more pinball machines because a lot of the cost is R&D so the more they make the better, I don't see them producing less from a business standpoint if they produced less then the price would be more, which would defeat everything.

Take a look at a state-of-the-art fridge with more buttons, more R&D, more comlicated components and electronics, more expensive materials, more labour, even the ones with LCD screens on them go for about $3,500 and they make a profit (they also go on sale once in a while), so I don't see how a wooden box with an LCD screen and coil tech from the 90s costs 3 times as much as a high tech fridge. The difference between an X-men Pro and Prem is about $2700 USD = approx $3600 CDN. So for the price of a high-end fridge you can have moving hands. Don't tell me there isn't huge margins because 2 extra coils does not cost $3600.

It's also clear what Stern and JJP have been doing to justify "greedflation" why do I want Stern rejected playfields? They are trying to justify these high prices instead of lowering them. Why did Stern permit to lower TMNT and LZ? X-Men is packed playfield, something Stern hasn't done in a while. Instead of lowering the prices they are trying to make it look like more value is added. So in that case yes I do believe the margins are huge because they want to keep those prices high.

JJP is doing similar things like Rad cals on their lower tier and topper included and now side art blades included in the LE. LE is still the same price but they are adding "value" items to keep it at the juicy high price instead of lowering it, because the reality is, those rad cals, plastic toppers and side art are all cheap junk but pinball enthusiasts see value in it for some reason and don't question high prices. These companies are taking advantage of people, but some are starting to wake up.

It's a hard conversation to have, which many won't side with me because they see their own machines as investments and want them to hold a high value and distributors want people to purchase with their eyes closed. But you know and most know people have woken up and the COVID cash cow is gone.

 

[ritewhereiwant2b]

If you are not a "flipper" for the soul reason of looking to make an easy buck off your fellow pinball hobbyists, you have had a GREAT run in the last 10 to 20 years.

 

[SolidStates]

They produce more pinball machines because a lot of the cost is R&D so the more they make the better, I don't see them producing less from a business standpoint if they produced less then the price would be more, which would defeat everything.

It's also clear what Stern and JJP have been doing to justify "greedflation" why do I want Stern rejected playfields? They are trying to justify these high prices instead of lowering them. Why did Stern permit to lower TMNT and LZ? X-Men is packed playfield, something Stern hasn't done in a while. Instead of lowering the prices they are trying to make it look like more value is added. So in that case yes I do believe the margins are huge because they want to keep those prices high.

I'm not sure this is greed more than Stern finding a clever way to give away useless playfields as opposed to throwing them out. With that being said I can't imagine anyone on the fence on paying 10k for a machine and the deciding factor being a piece of wood you may or may not want to hang on your wall.

I wonder if some kind of points system would work for NIB machines? Something similar to Subway where you get a stamp for each game purchased and after purchasing X number of games you can get a discount or something. That would be a good way to reward loyalty without having to reserve games for people who may not want them while stopping a potential customer from buying them.

I wouldn't be shocked if John Wick and Venom either get discounted or become a part of some kind of promo in 2025. I like the games myself but it seems like they got caught in the crossfire where demand was falling while production was increasing

 

[ManaLounge]

They produce more pinball machines because a lot of the cost is R&D so the more they make the better, I don't see them producing less from a business standpoint if they produced less then the price would be more, which would defeat everything.

I'm not sure this is greed more than Stern finding a clever way to give away useless playfields as opposed to throwing them out. With that being said I can't imagine anyone on the fence on paying 10k for a machine and the deciding factor being a piece of wood you may or may not want to hang on your wall.

I wonder if some kind of points system would work for NIB machines? Something similar to Subway where you get a stamp for each game purchased and after purchasing X number of games you can get a discount or something. That would be a good way to reward loyalty without having to reserve games for people who may not want them while stopping a potential customer from buying them.

I wouldn't be shocked if John Wick and Venom either get discounted or become a part of some kind of promo in 2025. I like the games myself but it seems like they got caught in the crossfire where demand was falling while production was increasing

Yeah I actually quote like Venom and Wick too. Maybe it's the fan layout styles that some people aren't into? Not sure but I think they're both underrated.

I'm actually a video game developer by trade, and while R&D will play a part here, it will be way outcosted by manufacturing costs. The teams are small, tiny compared to video games. Video games you can make once and scale infinitely given demand. Pinball machines yes you design once but there's a factory and material input cost attached to every unit sold. So yes, R&D and license costs will have a set figure that needs to be recouped, but I wouldn't think it's operation gravy train after that. A ton of work goes into building each one!

In regards to the stamps, yeah neat idea again but noone is allowed to sell lower than MSRP via any method. Discount or offering a bonus or whatever.

My for sale threads are the best haha

So.. anyone want an X-Men LE? Lol

 

[pinballjah]

Yeah I actually quote like Venom and Wick too. Maybe it's the fan layout styles that some people aren't into? Not sure but I think they're both underrated.

I'm actually a video game developer by trade, and while R&D will play a part here, it will be way outcosted by manufacturing costs. The teams are small, tiny compared to video games. Video games you can make once and scale infinitely given demand. Pinball machines yes you design once but there's a factory and material input cost attached to every unit sold. So yes, R&D and license costs will have a set figure that needs to be recouped, but I wouldn't think it's operation gravy train after that. A ton of work goes into building each one!

In regards to the stamps, yeah neat idea again but noone is allowed to sell lower than MSRP via any method. Discount or offering a bonus or whatever.

My for sale threads are the best haha

So.. anyone want an X-Men LE? Lol

I think some distributors in the US do sell below MSRP. Maybe its not officially allowed, but they do it anyway to make the sale.

 

[MichaelQPinball]

As someone who spent his time at the back of Jerry's line I can agree I don't like it but having said that I know Jeff is new and just exploring ways to sell his product. I'm sure all the negative feedback will be taken constructively moving forward as this man truly is a pleasure to deal with and again... just starting out! John Wick ROCKS... Pinballs are TOO EXPENSIVE and KEEP FLIPPIN Y'all!!!!! Christ is King!!!!

 

[ManaLounge]

As someone who spent his time at the back of Jerry's line I can agree I don't like it but having said that I know Jeff is new and just exploring ways to sell his product. I'm sure all the negative feedback will be taken constructively moving forward as this man truly is a pleasure to deal with and again... just starting out! John Wick ROCKS... Pinballs are TOO EXPENSIVE and KEEP FLIPPIN Y'all!!!!! Christ is King!!!!

Thanks for the kind words brother!