Well probably going to be looking to hire a good tech come end of January Money is no issue if anyone knows a good proven one.
Not sure what else I should be checking for but any advice is always appreciated .
Thanks all
David
BelleRiver, Ontario
This is where im at Video high speed help
- Thread starter VA3AVP
- Start date
Well probably going to be looking to hire a good tech come end of January Money is no issue if anyone knows a good proven one.
Not sure what else I should be checking for but any advice is always appreciated .
Thanks all
David
BelleRiver, Ontario
eh97ac
Active Member
There are two automotive relays under the PF for the flashers, controlling the left and right sides. In the pics below, they are aqua blue. Check them out to see if they are functioning and/or hooked up correctly
http://www.theteardown.com/gallery/details.php?image_id=676
http://www.theteardown.com/gallery/details.php?image_id=678
http://www.theteardown.com/gallery/details.php?image_id=676
http://www.theteardown.com/gallery/details.php?image_id=678
Thanks Menace I will definitely be in touch with you this game is a keeper I know will get it working with some help.
Thanks I really studied good close up pictures of those relays closely I think I have them rite but could be off. Is the police light on all the time ? I was assuming it only came on during certain segments of the game is this correct?
If I ground out one pin on the police light relay with my tester the light and motor come on but I am guessing that in proper game mode the relay would get a signal and ground itself out to that pin to make the light function?
BMHouze
Well-Known Member
sylvain
Active Member
Here's an extract from the game manual - Solenoids table, clarifying which flasher is controlled by what
Some flashers are driven directly by a drive transistor, other flashers by a drive transistor then a relay (and usually resistors under the playfield too).
Update: Have you tried the alligator clip trick (one end connected to ground in the head, and the other end briefly touching the metal tab of the drive transistor associated with the non-working flash lamp?
Does the lamp work with this test or not?
- if yes, the wiring is good, but the drive transistor or the signal arriving at its base is not good; e.g. board work;
- if no, then the issue is definitely with connector/wiring/resistors/bulbs.
Easy fix - for someone with pinball and/or electronic troubleshooting/repair experience.
I wish I was closer - this would be fixed by now.
Good luck!
Cheers,
- Sylvain.
Some flashers are driven directly by a drive transistor, other flashers by a drive transistor then a relay (and usually resistors under the playfield too).
Update: Have you tried the alligator clip trick (one end connected to ground in the head, and the other end briefly touching the metal tab of the drive transistor associated with the non-working flash lamp?
Does the lamp work with this test or not?
- if yes, the wiring is good, but the drive transistor or the signal arriving at its base is not good; e.g. board work;
- if no, then the issue is definitely with connector/wiring/resistors/bulbs.
Easy fix - for someone with pinball and/or electronic troubleshooting/repair experience.
I wish I was closer - this would be fixed by now.
Good luck!
Cheers,
- Sylvain.
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Hi Sylvain I have that info and try and use it for trouble shooting wish you were closer too. Similar to the test you describe when I put the gator clip on the ground braid in back box and touch one pole on the police light relay the police light works - is this good>? and does this tell me its a wiring or driver issue?
Thank You Sir
I will try your other tests you mention in a couple of days I am on standbye for this snow storm and its starting now will be a long 24 hours probably heading out at 3 Am.
sylvain
Active Member
This means that the wiring, relay and bulb for the police light are fine.
If I recall, the police light does light sporadically during attract, and during multiball (and during solenoid test 04) if all is well.
In your case, it appears you have a board issue (Q24 or its driver or upstream on the board).
If you touch the alligator clip to the tab of Q31, do you get the left blue flash lamps on?
How about for Q23 (right blue) ?
And so on - use the table in the post above to test each flash lamp circuit, to confirm if the issue is also on the board for these circuits, or with the wiring/resistors/relays.
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ok so Q24 was replaced would you be able to tell me what to look at next for the police light - maybe I could start there
Sylvian I did the gator test with my automotive tester most of these transistors were just replaced with new and I still have nothing they did not active anything and they did not illuminate any power in my tester handle.
as follows
Q79
Q22 Q23 Q24 Q25
Q6
Where do I move on to next?
all other transistors seem to produce voltage on my tester
sylvain
Active Member
From the problem description and details, I sense there are multiple completely separate issues in your machine.
(Note: The alligator short test does not prove the drive transistor is good)
1- shorting to ground the tab of drive transistor Q24 lights-up the police beacon - wiring is good; there is a board issue.
2- shorting to ground other drive transistors tabs for flashers - nothing happens and no power detected on your tester;
this is a separate wiring/connectors/resistors issue for sure, outside of the MPU/driver board (unless a connector issue/cold solder joint at header),
1- Let's start with the Police light on top - Q24:
If you are certain the new Q24 is good (a TIP102, correct?), properly inserted and properly soldered:
- check/measure resistors 5R7-4, R49 and 5R6-5 with machine powered OFF and a multimeter set to ohms scale. Compare to values shown on the diagram for these parts;
- check and/or replace its pre-driver Q20 transistor;
- use a logic probe for checking signals originating from the TTL pre-driver chip U20, and upstream U28. Use the diagram for signals origin.
2- For the other flashers where grounding the associated driver transistor tab does nothing, wiring needs to be traced from
the power supply solenoid + power, to the resistors then sockets, then the return path to the connector on the driver board.
I assume you confirmed two good bulbs were present for each circuit (where they are two in-series for that circuit).
Did you check connectors and check for cold solder joints on the connectors and headers on the power supply board?
I cannot help further remotely unfortunately, limited spare time these days... And machines to fix here.
Please let us know if you find and fix an issue, or if you find a good, experienced and affordable tech to help you.
Good luck!
- Sylvain.
(Note: The alligator short test does not prove the drive transistor is good)
1- shorting to ground the tab of drive transistor Q24 lights-up the police beacon - wiring is good; there is a board issue.
2- shorting to ground other drive transistors tabs for flashers - nothing happens and no power detected on your tester;
this is a separate wiring/connectors/resistors issue for sure, outside of the MPU/driver board (unless a connector issue/cold solder joint at header),
1- Let's start with the Police light on top - Q24:
If you are certain the new Q24 is good (a TIP102, correct?), properly inserted and properly soldered:
- check/measure resistors 5R7-4, R49 and 5R6-5 with machine powered OFF and a multimeter set to ohms scale. Compare to values shown on the diagram for these parts;
- check and/or replace its pre-driver Q20 transistor;
- use a logic probe for checking signals originating from the TTL pre-driver chip U20, and upstream U28. Use the diagram for signals origin.
2- For the other flashers where grounding the associated driver transistor tab does nothing, wiring needs to be traced from
the power supply solenoid + power, to the resistors then sockets, then the return path to the connector on the driver board.
I assume you confirmed two good bulbs were present for each circuit (where they are two in-series for that circuit).
Did you check connectors and check for cold solder joints on the connectors and headers on the power supply board?
I cannot help further remotely unfortunately, limited spare time these days... And machines to fix here.
Please let us know if you find and fix an issue, or if you find a good, experienced and affordable tech to help you.
Good luck!
- Sylvain.
no worries I appreciate the advice will see about getting help when the time is rite q-24 only works if I touch the police relay to ground avoiding the TIP102.
sylvain
Active Member
If grounding the tab of Q24 does nothing, but grounding the one side of the relay coil does light-up the police beacon,
then there is a wiring, soldering or connector issue in between the relay and the MPU/driver board you or a tech will need to address.
Good luck!
- Sylvain.
then there is a wiring, soldering or connector issue in between the relay and the MPU/driver board you or a tech will need to address.
Good luck!
- Sylvain.
I may request some more info soon not sure I want to transport it but it is a possibility thank you Sir
Also just curious Bob from RottenDog amusement company told me there was another company not his that makes an aftermarket system 11 cpu he told me quite some time ago Bayfield area pinball or something had it available from time to time but I have not been able to find ANY information on the web to verify this.
BMHouze
Well-Known Member
The factory is down for Xmas break near the end of this week and down all next week.
If you are having multiple issues iy's probably best to drop it off as he will have to chase down each issue.
Some things fix easy and some take more time to find the root problem.
Brad
If you are having multiple issues iy's probably best to drop it off as he will have to chase down each issue.
Some things fix easy and some take more time to find the root problem.
Brad
Thanks Brad I found a problem with one of my plugs on the cpu all my switches are back and working and police light working as should - big sigh of relieve . I just found the one problem with my upper right hideout switch was just simply a bad switch. I replaced the diode and tested another switch I have with gator clips outside the game. And more luck the switch test works correctly with my other switch I am just tying to figure out how to retrofit it for the hideaway position about to post yet another help question, soon my only issue will be flashers and I feel that should be able to sorted out in time.