Why no Toronto Pinball/Arcade Shows????

[Coitusmysterioso]

I asked this question on the Ontario Arcade & Pinball Facebook group but wanted to get the opinions here as well.

So how is it that cities like Ottawa and Edmonton can sustain MULTIPLE pinball/arcade shows each year but the GTA can’t even sustain 1??????

I know there are plenty of people from the GTA and further north that travel to pinball shows in Chicago an Allentown.

I think one of the main obstacles is we don’t have many pinball vendors north of the border and that is what draws many people to the larger US shows. Being able to buy pinball parts and accessories without paying shipping is a huge bonus and unfortunately until the show is big your not going to attract those US vendors to come north of the border for it.

Opinions?

 

[luch]

Are you ready for the answer . This is going to be a long thread . Bottom line are you ready to loose money . Many people have tried and failed to continue . We have a local distributor that is not interested in helping out and therefore without them it most likely will not happen .

 

[WARLOCK]

Sure, I will have a go at this. I am sure lots more info. will follow.

1) Costs to run the show in Toronto would be my first and foremost concern.
2) Suitable venue to draw a consumer crowd, not just the collector crowd is just as critical a concern.
3) Support with games from collectors and business alike is a very important consideration.
4) Vendors from Canada and the US would also be a concern to address.
5) Volunteers and/or paid staff to run the event and tournament is also crucial.
6) Time and energy required and preparing a proper business plan to put an event together of this nature needs to come first.
7) Marketing the event properly to have the attendance needed to make the event successful for both collectors and the general populace would be required and an absolute must to have a successful event.

It isn't a matter of "if" a Toronto Show would be successful. I believe it could be. In years long past, Toronto Shows were not as successful as far as attendance from what the organizers were hoping for is my understanding, although I didn't attend those events as they were before my time in the hobby.

I know there are a few people (including myself) who would like to put on a Toronto Show. I do live events for a living and I know what is involved in putting an event like this together. Being a promotor and running an event is an enormous undertaking done properly.

On a small scale, Bluffs Pinball runs 52 private (but open to the public) league and tournaments events a year now. We have done this successfully on a small scale for 15 months. We have fantastic volunteers, patrons, management staff and games. I don't think anyone runs this many private pinball events in the country without it being a restaurant and /or bar or event venue. It is on our radar to do a Toronto Show, but we would be at least 1 to 2 years away from having a show. It needs 12 months to promote the event alone after booking the venue.

In the meantime, we support the Ottawa Show and the Hawkesbury Show with games for running the tournaments and great people and transport where we are able to.

Looking forward to a Toronto Show, but realistically, I see it happening in late 2018 placed in a calendar several months away from both of the the events run by our friends Josh in Ottawa and Chris in Hawkesbury. For now, attending and assisting their events in 2017 would be my suggestion. Both are fantastic events run by good friends.

 

[spiroagnew]

We couldn't even organize a tailgate party between the members of this site...as much as we say we want to do a show/swapmeet, it hasn't happened. The Church of the Silver Ball had their thing last fall, which was nice, but was a far cry from a full blown "show" (potential there though).

Key issues are as Warlock pointed out: distributors not giving a flying f*ck to actively support a hobbiest show, expensive venues in a central location and, to be honest, general apathy amongst community members.

 

[Coitusmysterioso]

All valid points......

Yeah I don't think doing it in Toronto proper would be an option due to the many issues mentioned above cost of venue being high on that list.

Maybe one of the areas just outside of Toronto would have cheaper venues but still be close enough to attract the crowd.

I occasionally go to Ottawa on business so I'm hoping I can arrange something the week before the Ottawa show in June so I can attend.

 

[Chris Bardon]

I don't think anyone runs this many private pinball events in the country without it being a restaurant and /or bar or event venue.

Hi from TOPL-running weekly pinball in Toronto for 20 years

The last time we had a show in Toronto was back in 2010, which is actually further back than I thought it was, so now I feel old. It was actually a really good time, and there was a good group of volunteers and games on freeplay. Main problem was venue-it was at the International Centre, which was big and expensive, and I'm pretty sure that the organizers lost money on it. This also had support from Starburst (at least as a vendor), which I'm not even sure you'd get now.

If someone were to run a local show, I'd be willing to bring a couple of games in for it, but there would have to be some thought put into infrastructure/volunteers to help move games around. I know that any time I've volunteered a game for an event, I've usually managed to get help to bring it TO the event, but finding someone to help me get it home is sometimes much more difficult (let alone vehicles for multiple games).

 

[luch]

Hi from TOPL-running weekly pinball in Toronto for 20 years

 

[WARLOCK]

Hi from TOPL-running weekly pinball in Toronto for 20 years

TOPL is great and has it's longevity and history bro! You have at least 12 different hosts you can count on, including Bluffs as only 1 location.

 

[Monkeybug]

As stated..."general apathy amongst community members" is probably a major key to it (along with high prices in the GTA).

If anything were to happen, it would have to start small and grow from there. It would also have to be outside the GTA. Vendor support would be limited due to the hassle of people having to do commerce across the border for such a niche market (and yes... Playdium doesn't give a flying f*ck about the home market anymore and they have a complete monopoly on Canada...just the way we seem to like it).

 

[maken]

London doesn't seem to share the same general apathy or community divisiveness. Might be a better chance of a show there.

 

[websherpa]

Speaking as one of the minor organizing players in the last one... seven years ago now: http://www.torontogameroomshow.com

It was fun, but we lost money. Our community plus the interested public just isn't (or wasn't) big enough to sustain something on the scale that we attempted then. I, for one, had to fend off and eat the cost of thefts from my parts booth. It was a good start, and I'd likely still be in the pinball parts business today if it had legs and took off.

However, I did feel that perhaps we aimed too high (the venue was very expensive) and that the church basement version that was done in the years prior was a better strategy (appealing basically to the hardcore among collectors and fanatics).

The US has a market 10 times bigger than ours in all respects, however places like Ottawa have had regular repeating and successful events, partly because of their scope, partly because the pinball community is a bit more "tight knit" and not as spread out as here int he GTA, and because it's sustained by personalities who want to take on the challenge.

Anything is possible if the person(s) organizing it have the drive and sustainability to keep it going. I agree with Monkeybug, it would have to involve some of the smaller dealers and be held in an accessible location outside the GTA that has some attraction. I always though that St. Catherines or Niagara Falls (anywhere just outside of Clifton Hill) would be a good potential with easier access for our U.S. friends and lower rental fees.

 

[Coitusmysterioso]

That's actually a great idea. Niagara would be an ideal spot.

I always though that St. Catherines or Niagara Falls (anywhere just outside of Clifton Hill) would be a good potential with easier access for our U.S. friends and lower rental fees.

 

[mwong168]

The Vancouver Flipout Pinball expo last September looked to be a great turn out and well organized too.

You can read the article written by frolic here:
http://www.pinballnews.com/shows/vancouverflipout2016/index.html